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| This is Bill Hendrickson from Big Love |
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| Kody's 5th wife, his Lexus convertible. |
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| Oh how they have changed...well some of them... |
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| Christine in labor... |
On July 30th Anonymous wrote:
CJ and fellow Living Room guests...I was thinking it might be fun to start at episode 1 and discuss each episode. We could kind of have a hind sight is 20/20 approach know[ing] what we know now. I watched the first couple episodes again last night and it was [so] interesting since we all know how things turn out.
Maybe it's something you would consider?
Heck yeah! Let's go for it, shall we?
Let's start with Season 1.
What were some of your first impressions of the Brown Family, particularly Kody Brown?
Which was a better representation of polygamy? Big Love or Sister Wives?
What were your first impressions of Robyn Sullivan?
Why do you think the birth of Christine's Truely was so downplayed in comparison to the birth of Solomon and his sister Ariella? Was it fair treatment?
Feel free to discuss these and other discussion points you might have below!
Some Season One photos for your pleasure are above!
Many thanks to Anon for this great suggestion!
I'm looking forward to more discussion about the Browns. I've missed it the last several weeks. One reason for more attention put on Solomon and Ariella's births is that there was less new material for the editors to use. When Truely was born, everything about the Brown family was new and somewhat interesting to the viewers, so there was a lot of stuff to show. When Sol was born,there was interest in the family drama of how the original kids would react to a new baby. By the time Ariella was born, her birth was about the only semi-interesting thing about the family to show us (even though we already knew she'd been born several months before the episode aired. Also, i'm sure Robyn is more comfortable with the cameras now than Christine was that first season.
ReplyDeleteThe adults seem so different now when compared to the beginning of the show. Now there are very few moments of affection (if any), very few smiles, very few genuine interactions among the women. The adults just seem grim and bitter. Was it "real-er" in the beginning or now?
ReplyDeleteI actually really liked this show when it first came on. To me, Robyn seemed to throw everything off from the very beginning. I know that this family had their problems before, but she seemed to throw it off big time. I also feel like so much was lost when they no longer lived in the big house together. They became neighbors who sometimes did things together. Their holidays, graduations, etc are celebrated the same way that we poor monogamous celebrate with our extended family. There doesn't seem to be much coming and going like in the big house. It appeared to be one family in Utah, now it's 4 families.
ReplyDeleteAs has been mentioned before, many of us came to the debut of SW as former fans of Big Love. It was interesting to see that the living arrangements for the Kody harem were similar to the Big Love concept.
ReplyDeleteBill Hendrickson housed his women in a compound of single homes all joined to a private inner courtyard. Kody babes lived in what I thought of as a "habitrail" house. (my kids had hamsters and each hamster had their own compartment within the large unit. The company that sold them called them Habitrail houses)
Two of the wives were upstairs, one downstairs. Separate kitchens, bedrooms, living rooms but all under one roof. Certainly easy access for the harem master to go from one wife and brood to another. Where even Bill H. had to go outside to the next house for his pollinating, Kody only had to go down stairs or cross over a threshold.
Such convenience !!!
*But we eventually did learn just how dedicated Kody is to "his conveniences." *
Initially it seemed like it was a doable arrangement for the Browns "if" that really was what the women wanted as an environment for their kids. Janelle had six kids in her habitrail corner, Christine had five and was ready to have her sixth, while Meri and Mariah lived rather large, relatively speaking, back then.
But I remember thinking even at the beginning what if these women hated the arrangement, hated hearing their "lover" going across the hall or down the steps to service one of their "sisters?"
And what if they actually disliked a "sister" and had good reason to feel that way?
What if this show was requiring them to put on happy plyg faces for the cameras, especially since Big Love did show wifely resentments, subterfuge and competition.
The hook for SW's success for the contract to be picked up after its debut was the looming entrance of...(cue the drama)......Sobbin !
In retrospect, one thing is clear that without her arrival the show could not have lasted long if it would be just showing three women and 13 kids all crammed into that plyg apartment house, smiling and giggling how happy they all were sharing their hormones (and such) via their stud master Kody.
I really enjoy the first two seasons and will rewatch them on occasion. I like seeing the dailyness of their existence. The mechanics of how they operate as a family. I'd still be interested in seeing that so many seasons later. The faux drama over commitment celebrations and wet bars is boring.
ReplyDeleteThey seem so much more energetic in season one. Their old house wasn't too far from where I live and I liked seeing a pretty fair representation of Utah families on tv. Their marriage isn't the norm, but their other cultural junk is.
Seeing the "dailyness" of the Brown Lives is what made the show interesting. The parties, vacations and badly scripted interactions are not very interesting. Maybe the Browns have too much involvement in scripting the show.
DeleteAgree!!! I think Robyn, and Meri had WAY too much involvement scripting the show after they first moved to Vegas. You can tell by the odd things that were shown. It also explains the bizarre trips like the San Francisco "boutique" trip and the many early episodes that centered around Meri and Robyn while making sure that huge jabs were taken at Christine and Jangle. I think Kody demands to be the center of attention but he's way too lazy to get involved in the script. He knew Meri and Robyn would take care of his need for being worshiped. Poor Meri thought she and Robyn were buddies while writing these scripts. She got played big time and did not even realize she was made a fool of over and over. (Example-San Francisco trip-She couldn't fit in the dresses either...and the trick they played on Christine and Janelle about getting the dorky dresses made back fired on her too...Meri's dress was so tight it looked like it was sprayed on. Meri would have been better off wearing the upholstery dress. Meri and Robyn were both in on Jangle's running shirt that was supposed to not fit at all...Meri's wet bar was a highlight which again made her look bad. Mariah had many episodes that were not flattering like the crying because she didn't get the house first. Robyn got the last laugh so many times! I think after Robyn was able to pull off the "Kody had to marry me to adopt my kids BS" she thought she would be home free and have full reign of the script. Robyn this and Robyn and Robyn that...worshiping Kody in between Robyn, Robyn, Robyn... She didn't anticipate the backlash of fans and Meri's catfish girlfriend. The fact that Robyn is sooooooooooooooooo boring. Robyn is probably irritated she had to pop out a baby to maintain the lead story line. I bet Robyn is miffed at Maddie for getting married too. Too bad Maddie and Caleb caved and let Kody take the spotlight for that episode. I'm sure Robyn was the co-star and not Maddie, Caleb, or Jangle;
DeleteDuring season 1, I thought that polygamy should be legalized. I thought that as long as they were all consenting adults, they should choose whatever kind of marriage they wanted.
ReplyDeleteAs the series progressed, I changed my mind. The Browns showed me that this type of marriage was very dysfunctional and unhealthy for all parties involved.
The Browns wanted to convince us that their lifestyle should be legalized, instead that showed us that it definitely shouldn't be legalized.
I agree. At first, I thought they should be able to live as they want. I remember thinking "boy, Kody must have a good job to support all those kids!" But that's before I found out they were lying about their finances. And I got to know the women and realized that they were so miserable, even if they didn't realize it themselves.
DeleteI never thought that polygamy should be legalized and I still don't, but I certainly agree with you both that the SW show definitely didn't help their argument at all and if anything it hurt it - big time.
DeleteWhile I don't think we should legislate based on whether something is healthy for consenting adults to do (kinda like banning sugar because too much is unhealthy), I think that SW was a great microscope into plyg life and "should have" (because many people don't see it - SMH) convinced every viewer how unhealthy that lifestyle is and how damaging it is to the esteem and mental health of the wives and how it doesn't add anything to the relationships between the too-many-children and their father.
So, kudos, Browns, for succeeding in doing what you set out NOT to do with your worldwide platform.
I think I'd have followed the show more closely if they'd been open about the details of their finances, the wifey calendar, how often the kids actually saw Kody, etc. But, I understand doing that would have required them and TLC to be transparent and honest; 2 things we know they had no intention of ever doing. And, in those areas the show was a huge failure.
CJ, I'd love it if we could go episode by episode and discuss it now that we know what was really going on.
I remember having the 'ick' thoughts about this family from the beginning - and having said so on televisionwithoutpity. Nothing these adults have done has changed my mind. As to consenting adults - yes, the 5 are. Right up until they all brought children into the mix. We've all seen what this lifestyle and financial burden has done to the kids psyches.
DeleteI Love Dogs - have you read any books by polygamists and ex polygamists?
ReplyDeleteThere are quite a few, including Carolyn Jessop's "Escape" and "Seventeen Sisters" - by the surviving sisters who are children of Albert Barlow-many horror stories here - one of the sisters, Shauna, is Joe Darger's mother.
Apologies that my above comments are off topic.
ReplyDeleteThe first time I saw the show all I could think about is how can they afford to live? Granted they didn't have a lot of visible material items but still. When they were on Oprah I was disappointed she didn't push then harder about finances. I still do not feel like they have explained thier finances to my satisfaction. I can not imagine how thier lousy credit and lack of constant income allowed them to qualify for the home loans....or how they can keep that ugly convertible as they can't actually sell the green stuff....sorry I'm ranting but honestly I just don't see how it can be done.
ReplyDeleteLike most polygamists, they couldn't "afford to live." The record shows that each of them went bankrupt in turn.
DeleteI think the show has become too scripted and too edited. It seemed more like a documentary type of show in the beginning and I don't like what it's become. It's 4 separate women, 4 separate families, 4 separate households and they're all predictable. And dull. I feel that we see very little of the real stuff that happens, just what they want us to see. All of their projects and schemes -- the group weight loss program with a trainer, the 'My Sisterwife's Closet' disaster, the real estate careers for a few of them, the back-to-college plans for Meri...all pretty much down the drain. The only thing that gave them some extensive coverage was the Catfish debacle. I feel that if that could have swept that under the rug, they would have. They tolerate each other and that's about it. I'd like to see Robyn address the failure of her online store and take it on the chin. Maybe even literally. I'd like Janelle to discuss her current weight loss program and how it's working. Or not working. I'd like so see Christine spill her guts, shelve the humor and enthusiasm for a moment and be real. I'd like to know what drove Meri into the arms of another man, even if he wasn't real. No beating around the bush. And most of all, I'd like to know how they tolerate a man who treats them like concubines and has only conditional love for them.
ReplyDeleteIt's like night and day the way Meri has changed since the first episodes. She was hopeful, brimming with enthusiasm, happy, in love, and feeling invincible as the powerful and influential first wife. There was an self assured joy about her. Fast forward to season seven, we find Meri isolated, unsure of herself and everyone else, feeling out of place, and always seeming to feel uncomfortable and awkward. Her use of the f-bomb often on recorded VM's shone a whole new light on her character. It's like there has been two entirely different women named Meri, she even looks so different now. She keeps saying that she is a strong woman, but she isn't any more, in fact just the opposite. Even her many lies and cover-ups have been weak and pathetic in nature. Events have broken her, hopefully the future will give her a chance to regain some of that Meri seen in season one.
ReplyDeleteGood points about the change in Meri. The light in her went off.
DeleteI feel like Meri has outgrown polygamy. Shes realized that shes not happy with her arrangement anymore. She just doesnt want to admit it. But I think in her heart, she recognizes her unhappiness. I feel like she doesnt want to disappoint her family.
DeleteI feel like Meri, like Robyn now, was only "strong" and happy at the expense of the other wives unhappiness. She was not strong in reality, just a spoiled first wife. That in and of itself makes olygamy so terrible to me (one of the reasons). Meri is manipulative and that hasn't changed, in my opinion.
DeleteThe interesting thing to me is that initially, I assumed Meri and Kody had the strongest relationship. I'm not sure if the show was edited that way or I was sidetracked because I had learned early on that Janelle had left the family for several years and it was obvious from day one that Christine was struggling. Also, Meri seemed such a dominant/1st wife personality--so I believed that carried over into her relationship with Kody (or maybe it was all the "lover" talk!)
ReplyDeleteHowever, Meri and Kody have recently been more open about the fact they have struggled with their marriage for years and they had been attending marriage counseling prior to the show. I find it fascinating their relationship was actually the weakest one. Boy was I misled! It's hard for me to picture a marriage relationship crummier than the one existing between Kody and Christine, but I'm going to put Kody's relationship with Meri squarely in last place.
I
Yeah probably because Meri wouldn't cheerfully share her husband which means she should've exited years ago instead of making everyone miserable. For the wives to get along, you would need a bunch of Christines (not too bright, not too skinny, willing to try). I say not too skinny because if any of the wives stands out in the looks dept, that won't work. The only reason Robyn stood out was purely do to her weight (and brown hair) in a world that equates most skinny with most beautiful. Barf!
DeleteThe first show saw the day to day lives of the family. Logan making breakfast, Meri pulling bonus kids teeth, Kody talking to Janelle before work even though it wasn't her night. Moving from space to space without complaining about running to the next house. Christine actually got to mother others kids like her own. Robyn took care of everything so Kodys visit could be work free for him and all time and attention spent on her and the kids he was about to steal from their father. I the lack of physical affection is noticeable in the last season compared to the first. They also didn't have so many strangers living among them. Christine's mom is fine. It's the neices and nannies.
ReplyDeleteI really hope the Supreme Court doesn't allow for polygamy. It's bad public policy. You will have men robbed of the ability to marry and their pursuit of happiness. You will have a drain on social security and welfare. You will have kids parented by several strangers. Imagine school and medical decisions when mother 16 can call or decide medical treatment for anothers minor child who is legally her bonus child? Which spouse can make decisions to pull the plug? If marriage isn't two but five and it's equal that a man or a wife can have mulitple partners the entire group would seem married to one another, the singleton sex spouse of the group will not legally be assumed to control the family. So Janelle could pull Robyn's plug as her spouse in a group. They will be legally allowed to raise their kids in a church 4/5 of their boys won't be able to fully participate in. I don't think they have thought this through. If they had stopped at season 1 I would be more okay with decriminalizing/legalizing polygamy. They just showed us how wrong it really is. I think it's lack of topics for the show. To allow their pursuit of happiness is deny too many the loss of their ability for happiness. Islam allows 4 wives. Very one sided. The numbers will be much larger than in the hidden communities of the western USA. The number of men without partners will not be insignificant.
When the show first came on, I knew very little about polygamy. I am a far to the left liberal, so I thought if a bunch of women can share a man, hey, good for them. It didn’t take the Browns long to show me a side of polygamy that I had never considered. As hard as they all proclaimed that polygamy makes them better, their actions revealed something completely different.
ReplyDeleteWatching poor Christine struggle with her sense of self while pregnant and in front of millions of viewers was heart breaking. Even though, I think because Christine had already been in the polygamous relationship for many, many years, and she had already learned to live with the "it's not about me" mentality, she still laughed too much, squealed and clapped, and sounded like she was all down with Kody banging Robyn, but we could see her face and eventually the façade faded and her real feelings were exposed. Robyn, on the other hand, had been in a monogamous marriage and came into the family with three kids, and I think a chip on her shoulder. Robyn had to prove to the other wives and their children that she and her kids belonged; she had to validate her kids as real Browns. From the beginning of Robyn's introduction, she not only seemed to be working over time at fitting in but she also seemed to be working extra overtime at fitting in the culture better than the other wives. Remember, their courtship was always front and center, their marriage ceremony was huge, their honeymoon was long and far away, and their house was separate from the others; therefore, it was more private and her time with him was not shared.
Even though it was obvious the other wives resented her and were jealous of her, on camera, they pretended to love her and that she was bringing so much to the family, including her debt, of course. It was more difficult for Janelle to pretend because of her concern about their finite resources and the addition of more people and more bills. I firmly believe that Robyn, using Kody, strategically planned to front and center herself and her kids so that she could become a favorite wife of Kody, a favorite mother of all the kids, and a favorite character of the fans. What Robyn didn’t count on is that the audience didn’t fall for her tears or her trying to womansplain everything Kody said, or her trying to act coy…bitch had three kids and she knew what she was saying…bedroom wife…gross.
There are so many examples of her pushing for front and center. For instance, the wedding dress fiasco illustrates just her skewed sense of loyalty to the sister wives. All the trying on the dresses and standing in front of mirrors and she does the one thing that proves that the relationships between the wives is nothing more than lip service because it wasn’t their opinion that she valued but Kody’s. While the overweight wives struggled to cover their fat by layers of clothes, she walked around in skinny jeans and short sleeve shirts. On several occasions she blamed the women for the failures of the husband and wife breakdown: She kept saying that she wanted to keep her and Kody’s relationship in the honeymoon stage like her mother but what she fails to mention is the honeymoon phase she was talking about was her mother and husband number two.
By the middle of the first season, sinkholes were opening up and swallowing their façade and the reality that was left revealed their pain. OMG the pain on their faces when they talked about him with the other wives and how pregnancy reminded them that there were actual sex relationships, which was dichotomous to Christine boasting he damn well better kiss her.
I thought that Janelle and Christine’s relationship was interesting: Janelle worked, Christine raised the kids. Now if they had kept the cameras rolling on those two, I think the show would have been a little more authentic. I never liked Meri because she seemed to put herself and her child above the others and Robyn was intrusive.
I think I am like most everyone else. When I first watched the show I was interested in how they made polygamy work. But, if you were to watch the first episode of the show, then watch the very last episode, you probably wouldn't recognize anyone. It's like they have all become very selfish, greedy and extremely unhappy. The progression each year is sad to watch. This is one of those shows that I would like to see a follow up in 5 years to see where everyone is.
ReplyDeleteI am willing to be that they won't all be together. I think Meri already has one foot out the door, Janelle doesn't care she just doesn't want to have to figure out how to make it on her own but eventually will. Christine is so brainwashed she might actually still be hanging onto Kody, and Robyn will be his wife in the real sense of the word.
They do have great kids and I hope they all succeed in their lives!
Pt.1
ReplyDeleteI went back and watched the first episode again, just to freshen it in my head. I can remember way back when I first watched it thinking that Kody is just the cock in the hen house strutting through the yard. He is just too excited to show off "his" family as if he is solely responsible for how wonderful they all are. Yet quickly you get the sense that the reality is the hard working women and the extra hands of hard working children is what is making the family work.
I first watched this show knowing very little about polygamy or about Mormon's in general. Of course no one knew back then either about how they really juggled the finances or their struggles for 16+ years before cameras came in their house.
They gave a "happy happy" family accounting, laughing together at silly polygamous jokes and word games, but Meri did fully admit that she struggles with jealousy, and Christine flat out stated that she wasn't on board with Robyn. At. All. Being Christine she tries to hide behind silly behavior and jokes, but her feelings are still there. I find it interesting when they stated that "they felt like someone else was coming along" well, at least Meri and Janelle said that "it's a little boring" and they need someone new in the mix. Christine doesn't agree, yet Janelle even states that she had a "spiritual witness" to Robyn's arrival. Yet I distinctly remember a segment in one of their "therapy" moments where Janelle blurts out "well, we didn't know that Robyn was coming before hand either" and a very pissy Robyn says "really?? Janelle??" before the camera cuts out. So....which one is it? Did God talk to Janelle and tell her someone is coming to the family before Robyn came? Or was it all just little Kody ruling the roost?
I think the thing that stands out the most to me is just the affection between Kody and the wives. While he is keeping it within their own apartments in the house he is huggy and kissy with each one, hugging Christine's belly and even kissing it at one point. He is shown holding hands and truly engaging with them.
One of my fascinations with the show has come from a small parallel in my own life. I have one husband of 25 years, but for the last 20 years he travels for his work. He is gone Monday through Friday and only home on weekends, sometimes he works local and comes home each night, but that is rare, and also some times he works away for 2 full weeks. I know what it is like to be married with a home and children and only have my partner here on occasion. I know going to bed alone, carrying the weight of the house and kids on my own shoulders, and down days when it feels like I just have a boyfriend who visits on the weekends and is gone quickly. The big difference is the fact that my husband is also alone, and not with another family. I just can't imagine what kind of head game that is. I truly believe that is a mental torture for keeping women under control and it's just shameful what that religion does to the emotional well being of women and children. It's perfectly acceptable because they are practicing their right to their religion. How can you have free choice when you are indoctrinated so thoroughly from birth.
Pt.2
DeleteAaanndddd....Robyn. Kody...sitting there in his "big deal" meeting with his kids giggling like a teenager when talking about Robyn really turned me off. I think it was the first time we saw the fact that Kody is really just a man child. He can't even discuss something as monumental as another woman coming in as "their new mother" and new "siblings" without giggling. This is a huge shift in the family dynamic and he certainly isn't serious about it. Then he can't even tell his daughter so she can understand what he is talking about, and needs Christine to tell her.
Mariah and Logan tell it point blank. It's going to be weird. They had no idea how right they were. Christine had made a very telling statement when she said that some women go into a plural marriage just for the man, and it rips the family apart. Foreshadowing much?
The first thing we hear from Robyn is how Kody is >>>HER<<< soul mate and she loves him. Supposedly they have been courting long distance for months, yet on their date they are giggly like teenagers. Ugh.
We know so much looking back. They kept their family going with a system of welfare and revolving bankruptcies. Janelle and Meri didn't get along, yet Janelle relied heavily on Christine as her backbone at home. Meri and Kody didn't have a good relationship and were in therapy at the time before Robyn and before the cameras came. And...I think the sole reason that Robyn coming into the family didn't work out as planned was because Robyn wanted the man...and Robyn wanted the sister wife life. She wanted the women to rally around her, accept her, help her, and be this romanticized version of sister wifery that she had in her head. Yet...she wasn't a sister wife to any of them. The first season shows Poor Robyn trying to fit in...on camera anyway. Then slowly the real Robyn comes out. Robyn wants what Robyn wants, and everyone be damned. And little Kody wants Robyn, so everyone be damned.
Brilliant, Roslyn. I loved reading your posts.
Delete@Roslyn, love your insights. Like you, I was a "Big Love" fan, and through that show became interested in the motivations to practice spiritual plural marriage and the mechanics of doing so. I had hoped that "Sister Wives", "Polygamy USA", and the other unscripted shows would help me understand how those who choose to live this way make the decision and what benefits this lifestyle may have that are different from more commonly practiced relationships.
DeleteSadly for me, none of those questions are answered. The shows almost never touch on the faith-related aspects of spiritual polygamy and spend little time, energy, or videotape on anything other than the most superficial mechanics of making such a lifestyle work. For the families who had hoped that allowing themselves to be scrutinized would make for greater acceptance of their choice, I don't see much of a victory. I'm still as ambivalent about the positive aspects of polygamy as I was when I started watching these "reality" shows. On the other hand, I have learned that Tolstoy was spot on when he wrote, "All happy families are alike; each unhappy family is unhappy in its own way". And I have come to respect and honor the work of those who help people to leave the various groups.
...funny thing...I never heard of "Big Love" except for reading about it on the old sister wives blog. I searched around and couldn't find any way to watch it, but after I signed up for Amazon Prime, they had all the episodes on their Prime Video. I took a couple of days and marathoned the entire series.
DeleteSince I had watched Sister Wives for years I instantly saw the odd parallels between the shows, I could picture Kody watching the show and taking notes for ideas of "plot lines" he could throw at HIS shows' producers. There were just too many things in Big Love that ended up in Sister Wives, someone was watching and stealing ideas.
The problem with re-watching the first epp is that what "was shown" may have been just that....."shown" for the show.
ReplyDeleteAt TLC/F8, Kody pitched (or was pitched) the opportunity to make oodles of easy cash, to get unimaginable publicity and attention (and for a narcissist this was nirvana)....and along that path to get the public on board with Plyg legitimization. Kody Brown may be an Idiot in normal behavior but he isn't without greed and a shrewd eye for a sweet deal.
Were the "wives" all on board with his plan to use his harem and his multi-mothered brood as a new and very lucrative income stream? We will never know the truth on that one. In all the Tell Alls that question has not been asked directly and answered clearly.
However, it stands to reason that once the decision was made to put themselves out there, surely at least in the first few epps, it would have required showing happy plyg bliss.
We heard nothing about a longstanding cold war between Meri and Jangle. Never saw a hint of Christine's plight with nerves and insecurities.Never heard of Sobbin being an abused, sexually harassed former wife. All that was told about Sobbin/Robyn was that she was divorced, with three kids and down on her luck financially. Oh, and that it was time for Kody to get a new bedmate.
However, we know that Kody was hooked up with Sobbin before the show first aired (or even filmed) and that it was no doubt a major piece of the original plot for the negotiations with TLC. So for any of the wives to claim surprise or displeasure at Sobbin's entrance into the harem had to be "for the show" stuff. Even back then it looks like creative scripting was going on.
Giving credit where credit may be due, none of the original wives were ready for prime time. That in itself had to be a daunting "job" for all of them. They deserve at least kudos for coming to grips with it all. Kody, on the other hand, obviously needed no prepping or propping. From day one of the show, he was like a baby looking in a mirror, delighted and enthralled with his image.
This look back to the beginning reveals some clear signs that possibly even then all was not honest or true.
@Amused; "From day one of the show, he was like a baby looking in a mirror, delighted and enthralled with his image." This had me in stitches. What a perfect description!
DeleteHonestly, the time spent in episodes over the years addressing his hair...the matching highlights to Meri, showing Meri straightening his hair for their "date night" so he could resemble her romantic crush Keith Urban...Janelle preferring he wear it in a pony tail.. and on and on until the ridiculous culmination this season where we learned he got hair extensions prior to some episodes.
Big Sky,
DeleteHonestly, he always made me think of what a baby does with a mirror. :)))
Such a juvenile, self-centered idiot.
Exactly right about the plots and scenes devoted to his hair. It was so ridiculous, and as you said, his hair was included somewhere every season of the show. It only served to prove how desperate the producers were for anything to film and air.
How DO those women..*any one of them*...stand him ???
It's creepy to even imagine !!
IIRC, Christine was actually the production conduit. She was the one who was a trained plyg media ambassador and she and Kody are/were the crazy extroverts looking to share their experiences with others.
DeleteThe wedding of Kody and Robyn got way more attention than Truely being born. It could be editing. It could be they were always downplaying births because they thought Meri would be hurt. Not Meri's fault just people act odd when around people who can't get pregnant whenever they want to. For Sol and sister and now the recently stolen children from their actual dad - all these events seem to be the only thing happening in the culdesac. Before they spent time on more family members.
ReplyDeleteBig Love had too many hidden agendas by the writers. At first it was supposed to make viewers consider more nontraditional families. Then it just became an instrument to bash and poke at the LDS church after prop 8. Come on Bill would have been killed by the Greens with that boat on fire incident or at latest Mexico when his mother cut off Hollace's arm with a machete. They had Carl shot him for replacing sod on a lawn? As if someone could do that to another's property? As if BIll whose staff from Home Plus was fleeing cause he was now "out" wouldn't have hired his out of work neighbor? Even the first conflict of wanting to suddenly stop paying Roman for the loan that in the documents in never ending interest payment is something he was entitled to in the first place? Who was really the bad guy? They would have known Margene's real age after the governor's mansion. He was known as a polygamist to too many people to be an elected official. And even if he were he would not have the authority to mess with the compounds or take control over the work of the legislature. The suspension of disbelief was a bit much. And no idea what was going on with the casinos? How they got them, how they lost them, how he got others off the project? Nicole would have been in jail with Margene over their tampering and ID theft working her father's case.
ReplyDeleteI never liked the idea of polygamy and never thought it was right. Never saw Kody as this awesome dad and father. While I don't really thinks he's an awful dad, I don't believe he spends enough quality time with each child equally (how could he). And I know he can't afford them and yet would insist on having more. Also don't see anything special or great about any of the wives. I only started watching when I realized there were others like me who watched just so we could snark. I guess it's kinda juvenile but it has made for some interesting Sunday evenings.
ReplyDeleteOkay, MrSpock is cheap---is there a way to re-watch Season 1 for free?
ReplyDeleteI was a Big Love watcher, and I enjoyed it -- the intrigue, backstabbing, internal struggles, and even the creepy Ben/Margene dynamic. The show also (partially) showed compound life's craziness and abuse, unlike the Browns... who only meagerly acknowledge the place from which they came. To me, this seems to say that it's not only bad press, they are also huge liars and hypocrites.
ReplyDeleteThe first couple of Brown episodes seemed cheesy to me and I really didn't get into it, but then came the Poison Pill (Robchin). The day that she wouldn't let Kody leave her house -- KNOWING CHRISTINE WAS IN LABOR -- and kept hugging and kissing him, I thought "uh-oh". She was sinking her claws in deep, and Kody was loving every second of it. He stayed as long as he could, and her quest to be his one-and-only began in earnest.
I think that Meri didn't set up Robyn and Kody. I think that she saw his interest (after Robyn followed him around in order to be noticed, if I remember correctly), and facilitated out of desperation to not have her heart broken again. Fighting Kody's libido would get her nowhere, so... if you can't beat 'em, gift them with a "hot", herpes infected side piece. What could go wrong?
In general, I got kind of interested in Meri and Janelle's twisted feud, but Christine's constant and immature screeching was why I only watched once in a while. She was (and still is) so fake, but now I get it.
And I did like the kids and felt sorry for them a lot. Having a "new mom" and "new brother and sisters" had to have been traumatic, especially considering their somewhat secluded and unworldly background. Sometimes their faces seemed to look at Robyn knowingly, though, so maybe I'm wrong.
Then I decided to do some looking around online for info on these idiots and found the old SW blog, which kept me reading for days, and the politicsrusprinciple blog, which kept me reading for years - literally, I still read it. I also started to read websites that featured ex-polygamy and/or ex-Mormon members, studied the subject, and I learned a lot about both polygamy and the Mormon church.
Now I very rarely watch the show and only comment occasionally, but I still love to read CJs blog and all of the great comments and insights from her and everyone here!
Never watched Big Love, but SW kinda weirded me out for awhile. I was immediately suspicious of Robyn, and I figured that the Browns were struggling through cycles of feast and famine when it came to money. I thought Christine was eccentric (I didn't dislike her, but I didn't really "get" her until later), Janelle sweet and practical, and Meri...well, I didn't know exactly what to make of Meri. She seemed tranquil enough, but she never came off overwhelingly happy. You could tell she'd had her struggles, but she and the other wives looked like they had a rhythm going together.
ReplyDeleteI don't think Robyn is as evil as others want to make her, but I always questioned why she was even there. It's tempting to blame her all on Kody's midlife crisis, but I think Meri was telling the truth when she claims responsibility for promoting Robyn's presence. She liked Robyn and wanted a particular friend in the family. And since she and Kody weren't getting along, maybe she felt that promoting her friend as a wife candidate was a gesture of goodwill.
As for Robyn herself, she was pretty clear that she wanted a husband who would support her children. She was obviously not cutting it on her own, so I'm not going to judge her desire to solve the problem via marriage. But, I do question her choice of a polygamous family. Granted, having three children wasn't going to make her attractive to a conventional, monogamist man. I suppose she felt it was easiest to fall back on her polygamist heritage because potential new families would be more flexible about bringing children into the relationship. But, polygamists would likely be in less of a position to handle them financially.
As for the way things were covered on the show. I'm sure a lot of it has to do with producers and their storylines. Obviously, we only saw a brief sliver of their lives, and a heavily edited sliver at that. I never got the sense that Christine's pregnancy was being shortchanged. Like someone else posted, in the early seasons there was less need to create drama or dwell on family additions because there was so much going on that was new and interesting to the viewers. If anything, I got the sense that the Robyn-centric stuff was more the result of producer meddling than Robyn or Kody desiring more coverage.
I watched in the beginning because I was interested in how polygamy worked, turns out it doesn't, but watching the first season you could see how Robyn (at the beginning) was Kody's favorite. He was almost giddy to spend time with her. I noticed Meri was more of a doormat at the beginning, constantly 'lover this' and 'lover that'. Janelle was emotionally checked out and didn't appear to value herself very much. Christine seemed somewhat upset about the 'new wife' and she had to stuff her feelings down for ratings, which was miserable to watch. I think the entire show would have more fans and more seasons if they were honest about everything.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteI tried to watch Big Love and it just got so predictable and crazy. But, it seems that BL and the sister wives shared some very common tropes: 1) jealous wives; 2) barren versus fertile wives; 3) self esteem issues; 4) children without much guidance from the father; 5) big debt; 6) categorized wives (worker bee, cooker bee, tranquil bee, and the bedroom bee); and 7) misogynistic struttin' husband.
ReplyDeleteIn spite of the sister wives' protest of not being jealous, they are so freakin' jealous. Those women cannot share a kitchen but we are expected to believe they share a husband. Kody brags that polygamy makes the women work on those weaknesses but there isn't anywhere that shows that the men work on their weaknesses....remember how upset he got when Meri said imagine sharing your wives with another man...his beady little eyes couldn't grasp nor could he hide the repulsion of competing with another man....tsk, tsk, tsk.....And, while Christine is getting ready to birth her last child, Kody has to consult with her doctor about his barren wives infertility....wow...even in labor, Christine must be reminded that he is having sex with another woman...And then there's all the passive aggressive attacks towards Meri meant to rub it in that she only had one child and Meri's making sure that she gets what she deserves even though she only has the one child....fertile against the barren. All four of the wives, including Robyn, have self esteem issues. When they even talk about him with the other wives, they pull at their clothes and often cry. Their emotions are on the verge of betraying them on every front. Even though they have all admitted their unhappiness, they are not strong enough to leave him. We all have heard Kody refer to the kids as Meri's kid, Christine's kids.....and the wives raise the kids and handle the discipline of those kids...he waltzes in, like so many other husbands in polygamous relationships, and the wife tries to make his life perfect: good food, quiet kids, no stress.....And the debt issue that even monogamous folks struggle with is times the amount of wives....four bankruptcies, four families getting government aide....Kody makes no bones about his needs being met are the reason for polygamy...he is such a stud that one woman cannot provide all he needs so he has to have multiple wives...he even said Christine is the cook; Janelle is his contemporary or buddy; Meri provides a quiet house; and Robyn...well....he tried not to smile but Robyn provides reason....sure she provides reason with her fifth grade education...okay, that was mean. And finally, the husbands as misogynistic heads of house. The fact that they don't believe for one moment that there should be brother husbands seals the hierarchy of who is valued and who is not. But, most of those men, Kody included, do not care about their wives' feelings or their struggles....it is a sad situation. So for me, watching the fiction of BL and watching the sort of fiction of SW just reinforced the tropes that seem to come from those types of relationships.
There is a rapid "failing health" issue for Kody Brown that has been reported in a number of articles and is apparently an extremely serious medical condition. No further details are provided in any of the articles that I've been reading. Is it out of respect for the family's privacy that these publications do not name what he is suffering from? I don't think so, after seeing Meri's cancer scare in headlines from these very same publications. Kody has appeared healthy, at least on the surface, from season 1, right through season 7.
ReplyDeletedebbie, do you have a link to any of these articles?
DeleteI do. Before I link I'd like to get permission from cynicaljinx, in case it's forbidden to do so. Im a newbie here and want to strictly follow her rules.
ReplyDeleteHello all! I’m a longtime lurker, but I’ve never commented. I watched the first several seasons of SW but can no longer stomach it, and I just come here for the recaps now. Anyway, I’m coming out of lurkdom to say that I’m currently reading the book Escape by Carolyn Jessop, and it’s giving me all kinds of “insight” into the Brown dynamics. Ms Jessop was a member of the FLDS, so I know some things are different between that group and the AUB, but life in polygamy seems to be miserable all around. In one section, Ms Jessop talks about being polygamy “royalty” and how that affected her outlook, etc. – it definitely made me think of Christine. Also, she discusses how the number of children a wife has determines her worth – that definitely explains Meri’s ridiculous insistence on each family (regardless of number of children) having equal resources. The book also talks about the “favorite wife” dynamic, and how these women jostle for power, backstab, etc. just to have the attention of a man they don’t even like (so they can have more children and, therefore, curry more favor). Ms Jessop even describes her (ex-)husband as a narcissist and says that he enjoyed having his wives fight over him – sound like anyone else we know?!!? Probably many posters and readers here have already read this book – I may be a little late to the game here with this… If not, though, it’s been a fascinating read so far, and you may consider checking it out (although it also has some mentions of domestic abuse, so be careful if that would be a trigger for you). Thanks for reading my first post! Hope it's not too off-topic for the conversation here.
ReplyDeletewelcome longtime lurker and thank you for posting! I enjoyed reading your comments on Carolyn Jessop's book as I had been thinking of grabbing it at the library and now I will! It definitely would provide more context and insight for the Brown's. It always fascinated me that Meri insisted from the beginning on having equal resources which I don't think would be the norm at all in most other polygamous families. I always thought it was a function of the power Meri had within the family to demand this and that Janelle who "did their finances" was too nonconfrontational to speak up and make an issue about it--instead she would make many passive agressive remarks about the unfairness of it. I'm not sure why Christine would not make more of a fuss about the inequities financially except for that she is so oblivious and Janelle was helping her pay her bills, she was probably clueless.
DeleteThanks for the warm welcome, Big Sky! I agree with your comment 100%. There is absolutely no logic to Meri’s argument that she deserves the same resources as her sister wives because she wanted more children and would have had more if she could. That would be like me contacting Yale and demanding a diploma because I wanted to go there and would have if I were smart enough to be admitted (and rich enough to afford the tuition)! Utter lunacy!! Is infertility fair? Certainly not. But is it fair that Christine and Janelle’s children go with less (or without) while Meri lives in relative comfort? No way! Posters here have cited this example to show that Meri is selfish and manipulative – and she probably is. However, I also believe this is a perfect example of the dysfunction of the polygamous lifestyle. From childhood, girls and women have to beg, borrow and steal for every dime and every scrap of attention. By the time they are “sister wives,” they are so entrenched in this “survivalist” mindset they would sacrifice the health and well-being of children in order to have a small sense of worth and security for themselves. I cannot imagine a worse advertisement for polygamy than that.
DeleteThe Christian Post is reporting (as of 8-16) that Kody is experiencing "failing health". Anyone know anything about this site?
ReplyDeleteI wouldn't put any stock in it. The article seems to be in less than fluent English - also says that Season 7 revealed that the 4 wives wanted to divorce him, and that he wants to add 2 new wives. It seems all the Christian gossip websites get their news from the same source.
DeleteNow the all about the tea site article about Mariah having a drink on her 21st birthday, with twitter comments from Logan seems more believable. Sounds like Mariah has joined her brother in not being religious (and not being AUB or Mormon) for now.
Just trying to drum up publicity and interest in the next season, keeping their names in the celebrity papers. I'm sure there's nothing to it at all.
DeleteIt occurs to me after thinking about Meri's insistence on getting equal share of money with just one child that she squandered a golden opportunity. She could have used her extra money to provide extra treats for all the other kids. She could have taken them out to parks and zoos, the movies, or simply given one on one time. It certainly couldn't be frequent for any one kid, given the number of kids, but it still would have made her a cool aunt to do things with. And that would have helped her Sister Wives as well, since they were so strapped for money they couldn't provide extras.
ReplyDeleteWhat do you think? Would that have worked to build stronger alliances between Meri and Janelle and Christine? Or would it possibly exacerbate the jealousy?
Maria in SC
Anon 4:59, I don't believe that anything that Meri could do would lessen the jealousy of the other wives. If she had taken the money and spent it on the other children, the other wives would be jealous because she was getting points from the kids. If she had taken less money, it wouldn't have mattered because she only had one child and that one child was only 1 fifth or 1 sixth of a financial burden as the other wives' children. In the situation that they are in, nothing any of the wives could or would do would make a difference. The very nature of their relationship with Kody and with each other begs for deep seated emotions and certainly jealousy. I'm sure they all count every minute that he is with one wife or one kid, every dime the other wives' spend, every positive thing anyone says about any of the wives.....It shows in the absolute way they talk to each other and about each other.
DeleteThinking about the discussion about Meri's MO and that of the others, after 7 years of watching what TLC gleaned from available footage (and no doubt Kody also had *some* say in the final cuts after editing) clearly it obvious that what we saw was what they very deliberately chose to show !!
ReplyDeleteThey filmed, edited and aired what the producers (and Kody) thought would generate the most ratings.
It was always about getting the ratings, no matter how outrageous, enhanced, exaggerated and downright phony it may have been.
Everything became fair game, from nonsensical scenes of the Idiot's hair, to insane lectures on seductive mouth hormones and "stolen purity" monologues, right on through to showing depressed, utterly humiliated and marginalized women.
Nothing was sacred, except maybe for bathroom times and Queen Sobbin's bedroom.... that is when it wasn't being used for birth drama ratings.
Is it realistic to think that viewers really know the core personalities of any of them from watching a scripted, managed show??
Don't know....:shrug:...???
Amused,
DeleteWhile I agree that it's really hard to distinguish the relationships based on the program, I do believe that we can assess some of those personality types and relationships based on the subtext of the scripts. By subtext, I mean their body language, the passive aggressive comments, the explosive behaviors of the children, the comments he makes, and their comments on social media. Remember, Janelle's attempt at blogging? Well, not long thereafter, we get Robyn's attempts at blogging...Meri goes nuts on twitter; Robyn goes nuts on twitter. So, I think you can definitely surmise that there is competitiveness going on there. I also believe that based on Robyn's haste to get her children adopted and to be Mrs. Brown, there was some things that happened between the real Brown's and the step Browns. I suspect that we all understand that the show is scripted and drama that is created is done so to keep people watching but we all know they are not actors so it's difficult for them to leave their attitudes and biases off screen. For instance, when a real actress, say Jodi Foster, takes on a role of a heterosexual woman, it is believable because she can shut off her own life...she can act like a heterosexual even though, her entire life, she has been a lesbian. When Patrick Swayze, Weslie Snipes,and John Leguziamo played three drag queens in To Woo Foo, they were believable...they didn't, for one second, look or act out of character. But, the Browns are not actors so they are not able to hide who they are or what they feel in any given situation. So I do believe that those of us who deconstruct their program are completely able to come up with some claims and assumptions based on our experiences in studying behavior and on their actions and reactions on the show....So, I do believe they are jealous, they are hateful to each other, they are in it for themselves (herself), and her children....I also believe that Kody treats the women according to how his ego is stroked and what they give to him....But, we are not 100% accurate but pretty damn close.
Run,
DeleteNot doubting or disagreeing with any your points. Each wife (hopefully) is an individual with different awareness and reactions.
My thoughts are about the original stereotypes that the show appeared to put in place about the three wives at the very beginning.
Meri was the hi-energy, physically sturdy, boss lady.
Janelle was the shy, detached, background wife.
Christine was the silly, good-hearted, childminder and super loyal plyg.
This is how they were shown...at first!
Then when Sobbin was signed on, she was shown as the down-on-her-luck, sexy, eager to please and fit in. new bit for Kody.
And that too, sold......for awhile.
Then quickly their book was written, with several claims counter to what was being shown.
Years passed and plots were used that didn't look at all like their first template.
I am not stumping for Meri or any of them. But I do wonder if certain now "SW iconic" moments (like Meri's wetbar/ her equal $share) were created/ filmed/ aired expressly in the hopes that such clips would have reliably long legs for fan chatter and longevity. ???
1. During the first season, I found the Browns to be likable and far more "normal" and sympathetic than what plygs were often portrayed as, and I definitely think that was by design. The Brown adults were obviously on their best behavior, while production did a good job of balancing their seemingly insatiable need to exploit the freak factor that TLC is known for and showing what is likable about the family in the editing process. And no doubt, the Browns had an agenda for having a reality show in the first place and probably had some input. That's not to say I didn't think it was bizarre for Kody to have his douche coupe for courting, while the wives' cars were in bad shape. He was a raging hypocrite for telling Meri (something along the lines of) that thinking about her with another lover was vulgar when she tried to explain her jealousies of him having other wives to him during an anniversary dinner. I felt pretty bad for Christine throughout the first season, with his leaving to visit Robyn while she was heavily pregnant and when Kody was stealing kisses with Robyn while Christine was in labor. Amazingly, though, I was just trying to meet Kody where he was at culturally. I thought he wasn't perfect and at times a buffoon, but that he genuinely cared about his wives and kids. His wives seemed mostly happy and chose the lifestyle. Years later, I feel like that observation seems so freaking ridiculous and way off-base.
ReplyDeleteAs for the rest of the family, I found them to be likable. The wives all seemed to get along and to be friends. Meri and Janelle seemed to like each other. I thought the kids were pretty great kids, particularly Logan. Now I'm like...he was stepping in as a surrogate husband/father and that's pretty messed up!
2. I honestly think neither show is a good representation of polygamy. One is a fictional drama, that did its research, and did a pretty good job while still being entertaining. The other is a reality show that started out with an agenda, which was to make polygamy look awesome while lining the Brown pocketbook. Seeing the misery the wives have endured is pretty realistic, but there is still much this show is glossing over.
3. I thought Robyn seemed super nice and sweet in the very first season. She was a regular wolf in sheep's clothing.
4. I think Truely's birth wasn't as big of a deal to production because everything was still brand new with the Browns and so everything was kind of a big deal already at that point in time. It wasn't with Kody because it was just another kid with Christine. Sol and Ariella's births were bigger deals to production because they needed more storylines at that point. They were a bigger deal in the family because they were a bigger deal to Kody because his favorite wife was giving birth. The real tragedy isn't who got a better birth episode. It's who gets treated better. And we all know that out of the younger kids, that ain't Truely. Her treatment has never been fair.
After the first season, they really had me snowed. I felt like they should just be free to live their own lives and they weren't hurting anyone. Needless to say, this has changed.
At the beginning I didn't think much of any of it, I wasn't looking for the subtle nuances so it just seemed like an alternative way to live.
ReplyDeleteNow, there are many things that are very obvious. The whole series has been the Kody and Sobbin show. It's obvious Sob found her meal ticket. She didn't want to be a single working mom, so she latched onto Grody to ride the TLC train. When the money dries up I'm willing to bet she's the first to write a tell all and vet for a spin off of her departure.
Meri did not pick out Robyn for the clan. Kody saw her, got excited in his big boy panties (gag), and Meri went with it. I believe before Robyn came about Meri was Kody's favorite. I think they were in love, I don't believe he was in love with Jangle or Christine. When they were out for their anniversary dinner in season one was the first true time I realized Kody is a sack of crap. Meri just wanted him to understand and a little empathy, but he just couldn't possibly let down his "I'm the man" bull to give her what she so desperately wanted/needed.
I think Jangle is in this marriage because it was mutually beneficial. I don't believe she has ever loved Kody. I think she wanted to have a bunch of kids, but also wanted to work and be outside of the home. I don't think she even cared much about being married. She could come here, have a family, have a job, and not have to entertain a husband constantly. I think her and Meri were probably friends and Meri was probably blindsided when Kody decided to marry Janelle, so Meri treated her poorly. I think that Janelle gave it right back when she started being the family breadwinner and used her financial power to back Meri down.
Christine was married for her name. I think she really loved Kody, and I don't think Kody really ever loved her. I think she was "happy" in her marriage because she would twist herself up to please him and that kept him coming around. Christine is the best actress of all. Acting like being public was a hard decision, like moving was traumatizing, like she wouldn't do it again. She was a polygamy advocate very publicly before the show even aired.
Now. Truely/Sol/Princess. Truely has been basically neglected by her parents from day one. Christine has been checked out since Sobbin came on the scene. Kody probably doesn't even know Truely's birthday. Her birth being aired was downright depressing. Kody was there to tease Christine about the epidural and catch Truely, the rest of the time he was making out with Robyn. Disgusting. The season of Sol (Sob's whole pregnancy and delivery) was awful to watch. Kody drooling over Robyn's fertile and able body, Robyn going on and on about how her body was designed to birth Sol, down to that up close and personal (gag) of Robyn having him...yeah. Sickening. At least with "baby sister" we didn't get all of the pregnancy fluff (but some fun added things, like the baby shower). However, Ariella's delivery is one of the only times I've ever actually almost vomited from TV. Robyn's water breaking...it looked like someone threw a bucket of water on April The Midwife. I was so grossed out. I was even more ticked at how Robyn was hinting that she wanted to go to the hospital and neither April not Kody took her. It was obvious she was in a lot of pain and she was scared. Someone in that room (including her parents, which is creepy in a totally different way) should have stood up for her and taken her.
CJ, I was re watching the first season when I noticed something: Meri had short hair when they "announced" Kody courting Robyn to the kids, but she had long hair at Robyn's birthday party. Kody proposed to Robyn on her birthday. This show has been contrived since day 1.
ReplyDeleteI have never understood TLC's business model/marketing strategy. If they filmed Maddie's wedding and plan on renewing the show, why not announce it? Why have the cloud of uncertainty? Would it not make more sense to keep viewer interest alive and do what they can to keep interest in the family and make them seem like a going concern? You would think if they are renewing the show (which I'm assuming they are based on Mr. Spock's info) there would be an attempt to keep them relevant by spending more effort with some positive P.R. or even just simple things like updating TLC's website. You think they would keep Jangle or one of the family members having a current blog for fans to interact with. I swear that network looks more and more like the low budget operation it probably is! And--for a family who relies on the show income for their very existence, they sure don't put any effort into the "business."
ReplyDeleteKody and his harem are not the brightest stars in the sky. I don't think they have a clue how to promote themselves or how to improve their brand or even what they want their brand to reflect. In fact, he is so arrogant and so impulsive that if he gets pissed or annoyed, he will just flip his fans the bird or tell them no, he will not take a picture. Even "real stars" know that their bread and butter is dependent upon their popularity with the fans...but the Browns have no idea how it works. I think because they live in a closed culture (polygamy), they don't really have the understanding of relationships outside of their family; also, they have such immature emotional development and very low emotional IQs....if I were a betting woman, I'd wager that they think it's fine to treat fans any old way because they think they are so awesome no one will find out and besides, there are so many fans....they can do whatever. Sadly, they are finding out how wrong that is. LOL
DeleteBig Sky, I think you hit the nail on the head when you said "they sure don't put any effort into their "business"". But then, when have they EVER put any effort into work? Effective self-promotion takes just that - effort - which is not something the Browns like to subject themselves to. Especially if they feel like other members of the clan are not doing their fair share, which I suspect they ALL think. As they also suffer from "finite resources" (who among us doesn't) they certainly won't be hiring anyone to do it for them.
DeleteThe way I see it TLC could probably keep quite a few people interested in the Browns if they do a cross-over show. Two options come to mind; They could have one of the kids, either Truely or Baby Sister, (most likely Baby Sister,'cause of Robyn) appear on Toddlers & Tiaras, or they could marry one of the older kids off on My Big Fat American Gypsy Wedding. I can see it now! Kody buzzing around like a humming bird on crack getting his spray tan, jumping for joy when his order for a new flipper and fall comes in. The hair, the make-up, the manicures & pedicures oh my. You just know that in true Kody fashion the entire pageant budget would be spent on him, I figure like always the kid's mom would have to come up with whatever the child needs out of her grocery money.
DeleteNow, for the Gypsy Wedding; Can you imagine the horror of any of the gypsy mother when her child says they are about to marry into "the Brown chaos"? I've watched a few episodes of this show and from what I've seen the men are hard workers and the women stay home raising kids, cooking and cleaning. From what I've seen of the Browns, Kody isn't real big on working & the "wives" aren't real big on cleaning. I know they all act like Meri is so clean & organized but I think it's all relative. She could be an absolute slob and still be neat & tidy in comparison to some of the others. Not naming names, just saying..... I could amuse myself for hours watching either of these though.
i just read that joe darger was 20 and his first two wives were 16 when they wed. does anyone know if that is true?
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteWell, Joe was 20. Joe and Alina (his legal, first wife married March 1990) are a similar age - Joe born June 1969. Alina born September 1969. Vicki and Valerie are not much younger - born March 1970. Vicki is his second wife, married shortly after Joe and Alina. So..it's not correct that Alina and Vicki were 16.
ReplyDeleteSo...his first two wives are (all three in fact) similar in age to Joe.
I think they give birthdays and ages on their Facebook. Also info is available online. And some of it is in their book.
ReplyDeleteThe sister wives are being re-run at 4am met next week on tic
ReplyDeleteHi everyone, I hope this isn't too off topic but I've been feeding my sister wives withdrawal with escaping polygamy on A&E. So incredibl, vastly different of a point of view from SW. I'm wondering if anybody watches it and what opions yall might have?? I wasn't sure where to ask this,sorry if it's not in the right place.
ReplyDeleteI like Escaping Polygamy. I like to see the women freed from that lifestyle. i wish they would do a follow up and show how they adjust to society after leaving such a dependent and dominant lifestyle. How do they adjust to freedom and life on their on their own?
ReplyDeleteMost of those escapes are re-enactments, some of those women have been out of the compound for years. It'd be difficult to show them "adjusting", because a lot of them are already adjusted.
DeleteIt's true that few of these could even be occurring now--since many of the "cast" our well-known to those of us who follow the happenings of mormon polygamy groups. Most of those women have been on Doris Hansen's show--some several times over the years. They actually clean up a lot of the "storylines", probably because they can't discuss the fact that primetime audience has little appetite to hear virtually everyone of the girls discuss rape after rape after rape (of girls of all ages) by their fathers, uncles and brothers. Also, those women are obviously scripted because very few of them are that articulate in real life. Their grammar, when unscripted/uncoached belies their poor education. TLC has probably been threatened with a big load of litigation, since that's the Kingston M.O., so i cant imagine them filming on the actual privately owned properties.
DeleteStruggling with my own completely unfounded addiction to sisterwives I realize I am most certainly not a 'fan' of the brown family. I don't watch the show because I just love Kody and his unhappy spouses, they could be anyone.. But rather I watch because the concept of polygamy fascinates me and I suppose I'm hoping for a deeper more honest look; after all it is meant to be 'reality tv'.
ReplyDeleteSo far they have scripted their lives to make it TLC worthy and fit within a time limit (though the last season makes one think that TLC is a bit confused about content worthy packages).. So in my quest of learning 'all things polygamy' I took another commentor's recommendation and read 'Escape' by Carolyn Jessop -whoa! Her life has been extreme to say the least. She allows you to see the extrordinarily dysfunctional hierarical way her polygamous family lived. I would guess hers isn't the most extreme example either.
If TLC/ The Browns wanted to make sisterwives work, they would have taken the show in an entirely different more 'honest' direction (it's TV it will never be representative of daily life) they know what questions viewers have- they know what secrets and topics are buried in the polygamous lifestyle. In my opinion they started off well, they showed us a likeable family of interesting characters.. They could have taken that to a deeper more fan satisfying level by addressing the basic questions of: Sex, Money, Time, Friendship... This had all the makings of an interesting series... Instead we have seen drawn out phoney boat making struggles, fake victim tears of catfished meri, janelle's weight loss struggle... And a lot of birth giving by Robyn. I don't think it is too late for them to regroup, realize if they want this to work they have to skip pretending to 'tell all' and actually give the viewers an inside look at the polygamous lifestyle... This is a reality show after all.. They knew what this was when they signed up- it seems they don't want to go any further and in that case the show is over. I've got a family, I am not in need of knowing about the adventures of their growing kids, that is not why I gave up a few hours of life to watch a show about polygamy. (Let's face it at the moment it is not a show you actually sit through, it's on in the background while my daughter naps and I clean..but were it more honest it might actually entertain me to the point of hoping its on again so I can sit and watch.)
http://www.lifeandstylemag.com/posts/kody-brown-sister-wives-threaten-to-quit-112766
ReplyDeleteOn the latest promo on TLC MrSpock did not spot anyone from SW included. Of course, it could be that all shows are not included in every promo. Anyone know anything?
ReplyDelete*Anon abroad* makes a good point about nothing the show airs is worthy of any viewer's time or attention. It's nothing that any of us haven' had or do have going on in life. Including the fact that kids grow up, go to college and get married.
ReplyDeleteAlso, once the scripting for SW quickly went into inane parties, trips, absurd projects, etc, the show lost relevance. All of which had nothing necessarily to do with PLG life specifically, except for the number of the horde.
However, Mr. Amused was one of nine children (all with just two parents), so seeing a car (or cars) packed with kids, or having many chairs at a long dinner table was not special nor noteworthy to him.
The Browns offer nothing that is relevant to large families or to polygamy. The large families that I know, including my own large family counting 9 siblings and myself and all the four cousins who always stayed with us over the summer, have so much to offer in terms of how to feed and clothe all of them. The Browns, on the other hand, demonstrate waste and excess. All that convenience food they cook makes me ill. Hell, my children are grown so I only cook for my husband and me most of the time and I still would no more buy crap boxed with noodles than I would buy a corn out of season. In fact, I can all the produce either my daughter or I grow or I go to produce wholesale houses or farmers markets and buy bulk. I either freeze or can everything and sometimes dry a few things. Last weekend, we went to a trout farm and fished for two days and came back with enough trout to feed us and out kids' families for the year. We add those fish to the bass and catfish our grandsons have caught, so now we don't have anything left to buy but flour, salt, pepper, sugar, and coffee. We fill our freezer every year and our shelves with canned foods and our grocery bill is very manageable. We have fresh eggs and freeze the excess so during the winter, when the hens are not laying, we will have eggs to cook with and eggs to scramble....I'm telling you, it disheartens me that the freakin' Browns have no clue how to take care of themselves.
DeleteYes! Amused and Run, I have seven sisters so the whole 'big family' dynamic, been there, survived that :-) this was supposed to be a look into a 'healthy' polygamous family!?
DeleteAnon abroad, I think the Browns believe that if there is no incest, the family is healthy. They are quit to distance themselves from those groups that have been found guilty of incest or marrying children. I remember the disgusted look of contempt when Christine suddenly had the revelation that "men are such bastards." She fails, though, to see that polygamy does other types of damage other than hiding men who abuse children and enabling men to marry young girls. They admit that the women must work on their jealousy issues so polygamy, to them, is the impetus for making them whole. If they have a jealous heart, learning to share a man will heal them of that jealousy so all the talk about polygamy making them better is the notion that they grow spiritually.But, as long as the older women have been married to Kody, not one of them has been able to leave the jealousy behind. The other notion is that sister wives help raise the children and this little mini-village of maternal care and wisdom is really why they marry one man but then we see that no one, other than Christine, has ever helped raise any of the children. We have actually learned that Christine and Janelle thought Meri was too hard on their children and Meri thought Christine and Janelle's children were rough on her furniture and loud. The children have often been antagonistic between each other and we saw that when the older boys were picking on Robyn's kids and when Maddie was quick to explain why she hated Logan leaving--he was her best friend...her brother. The other girls, lacking that connection, smirked at her and even Mariah even teased her about it. The "family" turned out to be a bunch of baby mamas with their own families...Janelle's kids, Robyn's kids, Christine's kids, and Meri's kid.....they were never or will never be a family unit but half siblings with moms who compete with the other moms over garnering Kody's attention and favor. And, who can forget Kody's remark that no woman can every satisfy all his needs and then he starts listing: Janelle is like a friend and I go to her to discuss important decisions; Christine is the cook of the family; Meri is where I go to get peace and quiet; Robyn (then, of course, camera flashes to Robyn and she smiles, Robyn is where I go to learn to be a better person....yep...we saw that coming. Is that what they are calling it now...learning to be a better person.... So, what he confirmed that there is a talking wife, a kitchen wife, a peaceful wife, and a bedroom wife....exactly what we though. I guess my point is that we all agree that this show confirmed our suspicion that polygamy is truly antithetical to the human condition...no matter how much the Browns try to compare humans to lions, multiple wives does not a good relationship make and we all know that one lion may have a pride of females but he must fight all the younger and stronger lions and when he loses the first thing he does to put the lioness in heat is to kill off all the cubs....nursing lioness do not go into estrus. To justify polygamy based on the animal kingdom especially the lion kingdom is a false analogy as well as cherry picking the thing in the lion family that supports his claim but disregarding those that go against his claim.... It's like the popular argument: we can put a man on the moon but we cannot cure cancer or the common cold. First of all those are two separate issues. travel has no correlation with viruses. Now a more logical argument would be we can put a man on the moon but children are starving in America....the reason being the correlation between the two is the cost of the space program the cost to feed the hungry....let me stop....
DeleteThe crap christine and janelle bought in bulk like pudding?? they had no clue how to feed a large family on a budget. The cases of canned cream corn and tuna?? and fans wanted a cookbook from them on "mock recipes"
DeleteThe Life and Style magazine article concerning the upcoming divorce of Robyn and Kody was inspired by Kendra. Kendra Pollard, being a persona non grata to the Brown family, weighs heavily against the validity of the claims made in the article. Consequently it seems safe to call b.s. on said article.
ReplyDeleteIsn't this show actually proving that polygamy does not work. You have two sister wives, Meri and Janelle who admit they can't share a kitchen, or common space, and admit to not being friends or hanging out for over twenty years. None of the wives watch the others children. Christine and Robin have brought in their own family to help. One wife planned on leaving but gotcatfished.
ReplyDeleteThey all choose to live in seperate houses, and admit they can go weeks without seeing another sisterwife. All this shows is once they had the money they broke apart and each wife chose to basically live like a monogamous family in their own home with their own children.
"All this shows is once they had the money they broke apart and each wife chose to basically live like a monogamous family in their own home with their own children."
DeleteEXACTLY !!!
My thought is IF the show comes back it won't be until after January. It is always apparent when the crew/family is filming the show based on fan comments and sightings. I don't believe there has been any additional filming other than the wedding. It wouldn't surprise me that they made sure to film Maddie's wedding as either a "one off" special or to have in case they renew and resume filming this fall/winter.
ReplyDeleteBy January, a full half a year away even with footage of Maddie's wedding (which will then be more than 8 months old) as the opening epp......will anyone care about the comings and goings of Kody and Co.!!??? I surely won't !!
DeleteAgree Amused!! That has been a constant recurring frustration for viewers. The material feels so stale and/or out of sequence. One episode might clearly show Thanksgiving decorations and the next episode we are back to summer. It is hard enough for this show to maintain any illusion of reality, but when they show such clearly dated footage I can't think this helps their ratings!
DeleteTLC sure knows how to pick them!! The Willis family is now cancelled because he apparently raped a 12 year old.
ReplyDeleteI read that he had sex with an underage gurl twelve years AGO. The way it read made me wonder if it was consensual sex with a slightly underage girl who appeared to be and claimed to be a few years older than she really was. Still doesn't make it right, but very different than raping a 12yr old!
ReplyDeletePlease don't try and dumb this down. There is no such thing as consensual sex with a minor. 12 years ago, Toby Willis was 34 years old. That is not the same thing as an 18 year old boy having sex with his 17 year old girlfriend. If this is true, there is no defense for his actions.
DeleteOne report also said at the time he had children at home who were older than the victim. Since the oldest Willis kid is now 24 and this happened 12 years ago, that would put the victim 12 or under.
DeleteSo Mykelti is getting married on December 17 in St. George Utah. I wonder if they are going to film the wedding for the show?
ReplyDeleteMy impression was they ended the season and especially the Tell All (that segment filmed privately with Christine about Mykelti getting engaged) with a pretend cliffhanger about Mykelti's engagement. What would Kody and the rest of the family say about her engagement? Would they be accepting? Again, it will be so stale and disingenuous if they renew the show and pickup where they left off. Assuming they are not in the fall lineup, the earliest they would reboot the show would likely be January as they have in the past.
DeleteI can picture it now! The show starts in January with Maddie's wedding that happened 8 months prior and Mykelti is also married by January and we have to witness the faux drama about whether the family accepts her fiance.
Yes, Big Sky, you're right, that will be the story line.
DeleteIt would *have to be* since the most recent Kody-clone will be going on a year old by January, and because her arrival did not generate the ratings that TLC or Kody/Sobbin were banking on.
They have nothing left. The princess's birth was a ho-hum, Meri's catfisher cyber fall from grace is yesterday's VERY old, very stale news. Jangle and Meri's 20 yr.old standoff is hardly worth a mini-second's mention.
They are finally out of faux plots...out of even legit, yet stupid, uninteresting scenarios. Scenarios which are not unusual or unique to any family with growing kids.
No intended critical snark to Maddie or Mykelti, but at this point, neither of them are oozing the needed personality for grabbing star ratings for Kodyworld, especially in airing their weddings.
Frankly, it would be nice to think that these two young women could begin their marriages without having to play to the cameras and the contrived scripting.
SisterWives is done.......cue the Taps !!
"Frankly, it would be nice to think that these two young women could begin their marriages without having to play to the cameras and the contrived scripting."
ReplyDeleteI think not having cameras invading their new marriages is the best thing that could have ever happened to them. But... I wonder what the 2 girls think. Were they hoping to be reality 'stars' themselves, with the focus on their new lives? Were they hoping for a spin-off? Were they counting on the money? I wish them well and hope they can keep their lives private. The intrusiveness of the cameras is not healthy, especially for new relationships, and they need to focus on the real realities of their lives, not the fauxness of 'reality' tv.
Unfortunately it's not such a stretch to think that after 8 years of watching their mothers and Kody-Idiot rake in the TLC $$, that they too would want that easy cash.
DeleteIt could be that they and their spouses could very well seek the same cushion for the same little effort, not to mention the added goodies of comped trips, houses((?), etc.
And.....best of all, it would guarantee Kody that his narcissistic mug would stay in front of the camera.
Perhaps the tabloids are on to something. The one storyline left that would actually grab viewers would be the "spiritual divorce" of Kody and a wife right before they go to defend their marriages before SCOTUS. They could call it Escape from the Cult-de-Sac. I would pop popcorn for that episode.
ReplyDeleteStriking out, on her own, Janelle has devised S.T.R.I.V.E. , apparently for people like her. One can but hope for great success for her endeavours, alas.
ReplyDeleteThe first 200 tickets are free and there are 184 remaining. None of the $5.00 or VIP $75.00 tickets have been sold.
Deletenot exactly sure what STRIVE will do. it looks like a bunch of health coaches to help you move and lose weight but how is it structured to make money or what they offer over others? No idea.
Deleteokay, you made me look up Wife #2's twitter (she's for the Libertarian candidate - it's always interesting when people who were on the public dole think they are Libertarians) and then http://www.strivewithjanelle.com/
ReplyDeletesince she never got thin and is still in a majorly dysfunctional relationship, I don't see her as qualified for motivational speeches
I don't see Janelle as a "speaker" for any topic.
DeleteThis is Jangle-Janelle, the wife who stared at her feet or off into the distance for years of filmed couch chats.
Now granted, she did get a bit peppier when hitting the tweet keys as cheer-leader for Kody-Idiot when his image was taking such a hit the last year. But sitting in her McMansion tweeting quick one-liners is a far cry from standing at a podium looking out at an audience and "speaking" and engaging people.
Remember when Kody and his harem met with the 3 0r 4 phony capital investors to give their ridiculous Closet presentation. Jangle was all but mute for that event.
She struggles with spontaneity for sure, but she also lacks warmth and humor.
However you have to give her credit for trying *yet another* scheme for $$. What is this one...number three??
The Gym fell flat before ever getting off the ground. Her weight loss blog which was supposed to go somewhere went nowhere.
Wish her well, but hope this scheme is not solely dependent on her to generate interest and energy.
Amused, I agree with everything you said. I don't think this new venture Janelle is a part of will go anywhere. I think it will follow the path of all of her other failed schemes. I don't think Janelle has the motivation or commitment or desire to see this or any? project through to fruition. I don't know if it's laziness that has caused her other projects to wither and fail, but I do not believe this project will have any different outcome than any of the others have had.
DeleteWhy is it that meri acts like it's so difficult to spit out her words? Her talking heads are so uncomfortable to watch . She holds her breath and furrows her brow and squirms around all while barely completing any sentences . Why does TLC even bother with these people .
ReplyDelete